Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Discussion of Maia's on going development, including modding.
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Tikigod
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by Tikigod » Fri May 31, 2013 6:09 pm

UltraJake wrote:Does the problem really stem from a lack of OGL 4.1 support? I'm using a Radeon 6950 2GB (which supposedly supports it) and I even tried updating the drivers.
I am pretty sure it depends on the drivers not the card itself.

Whilst the card itself may in theory support it, how the drivers interpret its use can cause problems... and how the drivers work in conjunction with different series of cards also differs.
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SimoRoth
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by SimoRoth » Sat Jun 01, 2013 12:08 am

Depends if you get the compile errors or not.

If its just the black screen, a lot of times that's caused by a few things joining together to break the rendering. (one of which is one of my horrendously long lighting shaders)

vanatteveldt
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by vanatteveldt » Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:55 am

SimoRoth wrote: The errors point to your drivers not supporting OGL4.

Kinda wish I'd supported older cards from the outset, seems to be our main issue. It was released in 2010, so was hoping not too many people would be affected.
Well, not everyone buys a new computer every couple of years anymore... (possibly especially not the linux/df crowd that the game was at least partly marketed too)

I guess I will wait patiently until a version is released with some sort of compatability for missing features, or is there a workaround/solution apart from the obvious one of buying a new graphics card?

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Tikigod
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by Tikigod » Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:35 pm

vanatteveldt wrote:
SimoRoth wrote: The errors point to your drivers not supporting OGL4.

Kinda wish I'd supported older cards from the outset, seems to be our main issue. It was released in 2010, so was hoping not too many people would be affected.
Well, not everyone buys a new computer every couple of years anymore... (possibly especially not the linux/df crowd that the game was at least partly marketed too)

I guess I will wait patiently until a version is released with some sort of compatability for missing features, or is there a workaround/solution apart from the obvious one of buying a new graphics card?
Well to be fair, you'd need a pretty old machine to be running into problems caused specifically from outdated hardware rather than quirky behaviour from drivers and potentially combined with the way the game is coded at the moment that doesn't play nice with certain environments.

A lot of the people reporting problems are actually using hardware newer than mine (and better, my card is coming up to 4 years old now), yet after upgrading to the latest ATI beta drivers a few weeks back, I have had no problems running Maia at all in terms of support of my hardware... so older hardware (and talking reasonable older hardware here) is certainly still supported.


That said, there does come a point where work toward backward compatibility just to make sure people with hardware older than 5-6 years that was slightly lagging behind even then becomes counter productive... and given that Maia is a graphically involved game and is nothing like Dwarf Fortress, Minecraft, terraria or similar games that are very light on the technical side of the visuals, I think Simon already has a pretty good balance of that and it's more just working out the various quirks that crop up within that specification range.

Though I would be interested in hearing why you say Linux users would be predominately be older hardware users... as I've never heard that claim before. ;)
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GMAN
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by GMAN » Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:54 pm

I have had the black square issue, and everything else works great with the Catalyst 13.4 drivers on my desktop with 2x Radeon HD 7750s (mid-range card). My Mac Air (2011) is a different story though. Apple uses poor or outdated hardware in most of it's computers (tablets and phones excluded). My Mac has a GeForce 320M released in 2008; the latest GeForce series in 2011 was the 400 and 500 series with OpenGL 4.3 released in 2010. The apple drivers lack support for anything beyond OpenGL 3.3 (even in the software renderer) and you cannot update to nVidias drivers (I tried, broke it 3 times, and had to reinstall OSX to fix it). I have yet to test Maia on the mac due to not having linux installed. Intel Integrated graphics are another performance issue for this game. I have Intel graphics in a laptop with a Core2Duo (laptop circa 2007), and performance is ok. It still looks great but not nearly as fast or high quality as my desktop machine (would probably be better if I had a modern laptop, not this outdated one).

vanatteveldt
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by vanatteveldt » Mon Jun 03, 2013 5:45 pm

Tikigod wrote: Though I would be interested in hearing why you say Linux users would be predominately be older hardware users... as I've never heard that claim before. ;)
Well I don't have any data, but:
(1) a large part of the GPU market is gamers, and traditionally linux has not been the favourite platform for gaming (this might change with steam in the mix)
(2) if you use linux for simple stuff (email, browsing, light document creation) and do heavy stuff on a server (which I think linux users will be more likely to do) there simply hasn't been a need to upgrade the past 5 or so year, except for getting a good SSD. My 4 or 5yo laptop is still quite zippy, booting to desktop in <1 minute and running everything I need just fine. This is partly because a *properly configured* linux has a lot less bloat than even a well configured windows 7, and partly because linux users will be the ones to know how to keep a machine well tuned.
(3) finally, most people that I know that do hard core computational work on a linux machine will probably not be using the GPU much, as I suspect it will be compiling or running statistical models or simulations, which as far as I know are traditional CPU processes. (simulations and some modelling could be put on GPU I think, but I don't think it has been?).

OTOH, linux people might be more computer-minded and thus more willing to spend money on computers, and also more able to upgrade desktop computers themselves... so I might be completely wrong.

tl;dr I would also like to see some data ;-)

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MellowTigger
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by MellowTigger » Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:23 am

I've built my own pcs since around 1995, I think? I'm the type who doesn't upgrade (throwing otherwise functional electronics into the junkpile) until either a motherboard finally fails or a program finally requires significantly new hardware features. I don't mind if Maia will become the reason that I get a new video card (supporting OpenGL 4).

Predator106
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by Predator106 » Sun Jun 09, 2013 7:06 pm

amd drivers have supported gl 4.1 since jan 2011, even for linux.

i don't think it's unreasonable honestly to expect people playing a game to upgrade their gpu. directx 11/opengl 4.0 hardware has been out for 4 years. GPUs are the fastest progressing thing, too.

You can easily grab a pretty high end card for 150$ or less. the 6870 is what I had and that thing was excellent for what I threw at it (battlefield 3).

Simon, what specifically do you use from 4.x? I mean, as long as you aren't relying heavily on tessellation, you should be good.

Also, if you were planning on Mac support, which I believe you were, you should know that they only support 3.2 + a good amount of extensions.

Predator106
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Re: Maia Backer Alpha 0.26 release notes.

Post by Predator106 » Sun Jun 09, 2013 7:33 pm

stupid question..got the linux build to run, the release notes say that you can interact with it, build rooms and such, but all i'm getting is the planet..all input seems to be off, escape doesn't stop it. Is this intentional? Or does the linux build have less? :S

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